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Feedback

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General / Overall

  • Example feedback -- Sha2017.org-stitch (talk)
  • Otter!
  • a great event, much fun and much to experience and learn, thank you everybody! :)
  • Been there, had fun!
  • No music after 2am was kind of bad joke
  • The Dutch camp orga seems to not understand chaos. There is no point in trying to defeat chaos, you have to build your structure around it. This often failed. Anyway, overall I had a good experience.
  • Had a nice time & met new interesting people, thanks to the orga for making SHA2017 happen! BjornW

Projectleiding

  • Coordinating such a large event is a big challenge, it was a hard job.
  • When logistics entrance stopped working, volunteers who have been there for hours were freezing without instructions, I asked people in charge for help. Response was, "We have more important things to take care of"

After that two CCC people from Team Villages took over, without consultation, because there was no one else. You were contacted as means of last resort - if you are too busy to take care of your visitors, volunteers and have better things to do, you are not doing your job. Taking care of your own people who worked with you on the event should be a priority imho, not something you are too busy and important to do.

  • When asking for important input as Team Lead, comments were, and I quote: "Not now", "Thank you for coming and dumping all your crap on me." OR "Oh, you look sad it didn't work out, I will just go and fix it won't I, since you look sad - same bully style rant continuing" OR Yelling in the middles of the yard (I just turned and walked away at that point, to the surprise of the shouting PL member).
  • Many thanks to Attila for taking care of orders and money management.

Bar

  • Prices at the Bar felt like a ripoff to me - eg. EUR 1.50 for a candy bar. There are gas stations that sell them for less. :( -- Mkie (talk)
  • Premade Tschunk and at some point without ice while the drink itself was on the more expensive side.
  • No fruit Juice only soda stuff, so for abstemious the only solution was Pepsi and 7-up
    • There were apple juice/orange juice (and a 3rd one i don't remember, no one asked for it during my shifts) :) -- Bigshot (talk)
  • 2 "beers" on tap. I understand it has to make a profit, but was expensive - even for carbonated drinks. Didn't use it that much.

Cohesion

  • I heard a lot of good things about the silent lounge! Several friends enjoyed their time there, a great idea.
  • Shouldn't happen: Team Cohesion member exploding at angels of the Ticket tent since they came at closing time. Frustration is understandable, but this is not the team to practice

your social skills.

Content

  • Tardis room not explained on Frab so I didn't done 2 talks in the schedule
  • Very good and a good range of subjects. There was some overlap of talks
  • Opening ceremony was a bit boring and too focused around Stitch in the beginning

Content/Heralds

Content/Speakerdesk

Decoration

  • Sort of worked. The amount of time spent on decorating the portacabins might have been better spent on more site decoration
  • Not sure what you mean. Team Deco did not decorate any portacabins. -- Moem (talk)
  • I loved the gate and lights leading to it. I know how much group effort went into DECO during those awesome Hack42 weekends. Thank you for the great job you've done.

Design

  • I was happy to have colours to work with on the terrain, and it seems that many visitors enjoyed playing with them, too. -- Moem (talk)

Family Village

  • I was not part of the Family Village, but visited it multiple times with my daughter. This was my sixth time at the Dutch Hackercamps starting with HIP97 and the Family Village this time at SHA2017 outdid all other editions: a bouncy castle, 'ballenbak' and 2 tents with content tailored to kids. Awesome! Compliments to the Family Village orga team for making this a great experience for kids! -- BjornW
  • There were also sailing lessons for kids in the harbor (as well as grown up kids)... -- Andi2 (talk)
  • I was really not happy with the family village deciding to spend budget on an 'owl show' for the kids. It was essentially a circus act featuring captive animals. I fail to see what this had to do with SHA in any way (zero hack value), the animals themselves were chained up and placed in boxes - they definitely did not look too happy, and often attempted to fly away when a few children got too close. I really don't want to see anything like that again at any future events.
  • I second the previous point. Cruelty to animals is not something I want to see at the camp (keeping wild birds chained in small boxes is animal lover action in the same way as kidnappers and serial killers are human lovers).
  • I liked the train going around terrain, Family Village team doing so much on a tight schedule.
  • Special thanks to young and very young hackers who helped with Entrance. You were awesome!

Finance/coins/payments

  • I did not like the way purchases at Bar/Foodcourt were handled, by buying coins. Especially the no-refund policy. (this was added by User Derchris but not properly signed)
  • The coin thingy felt like a bit of a ripoff, as you would always have some useless plastic coins left over at the end. And the coin machines always spat out the coins on the floor, despite the attempted fixes with tape - it seemed they were designed by people who have never designed such a thing before. -- PoempelFox (talk)
  • The plastic coins are so unbelievable senseless. Don't we have this €-thing within the EU to exchange goods / services against cash already?
  • No prices for the coins online in advance of the event, No prices for the food / drink items online.
  • Coins are a pain in the backside. Also no indication as to which type of overseas cards would work. Visa/Mastercard didn't work, but Visa Debit did. World has gone contactless. Understand it is an issue in getting the money from the card companies. Cash still needs to be available for those who don't have the euro as their local currency. No way to get your money back for unspent coins.
  • Plastic coins also very susceptible to being 3D printed...

Foodcourt

  • While the food at the food court was good, there was not nearly enough choice. Especially if you wanted a main meal to eat and not just some sweets, your choice was "a burger", "fries", "noodles from a wok" or "vegan stuff trying to imitate meat". That really isn't a lot to get repleted, and at 2 meals a day you repeat everything multiple times. Also, at least on the first two days the food court was completely overwhelmed by the demand, the queues were endless, you'd stand in line for an hour. And they opened too late - at 14:00 on day 1, only the 'holy crepe' was open, nothing else. Did you not expect people to eat on the first day?! -- PoempelFox (talk)
  • I wasn't so pleased with food court. The food was ok, but just ok while only delivering small amounts of food seemed like a ripoff for me. Disclosure: I'm spoiled by the food from the angel kitchen :)
  • Great improvement from OHM2013 :) -- Bigshot (talk)
  • Being dependent on the food court would have meant starving from both a lack of nutritional value (portions way too small, not enough choice for 5 days, more snacks than meals, not enough vegetarian options) as well as a lack of funds (7,50 for a small burger!?). Thanks to Millyway's, Pizza Village, home-cooking and Italian Embassy disaster was averted and I survived ;). Maybe next time a system similar to the Angel kitchen could be setup for the whole camp? -- BjornW
  • Or you could have volunteered and gotten awesome, abundant food at no cost ;-) I don't think feeding 3500 people from one kitchen is feasible; kitchens scale, but they don't scale THAT much. -- Moem (talk)
  • Very limited selection and expensive. "Cook like your mom" was good.
  • Stock up at a supermarket before going to the camp. Fruits, salads, freshly baked bread, yoghurt, bottles of juice and long-storage milk will last 3-4 days without a fridge. The volunteer/orga kitchen was excellent, with buffet warm meals, but you'd need to volunteer to get that. -- Vadim Makarov (talk)

Infodesk / wiki

  • Worked well
  • Excellent job, very helpful, positive and relaxed. Also people inside the Team supporting each other.

Logistics (shuttle, waste)

  • The ability to post packages to the event was invaluable. I was able to repair diesel bike and go home. --Russell (talk)
  • Luggage shuttle, so useful, very helping, so wow!
  • No bottle drop points :(
  • Waste bins at campsite areas nowhere near big enough, consider using 1100litre eurobins in the camping areas, else volunteers are forever picking up bags from the ground. More glass recycling needed -- Sha2017.org-will-h (talk)
    • Bigger bins would have caused issues in the emptying of them on a daily basis (impossible to hoist them into a golf cart and the walking distance was enormous. Wouldn't fit the trash compactor either). Most days we were all right and only minor buildup occured. We didn't anticipate the holy shit storm on teardown day. Did not see that people just dump crap on the floor because they didn't bring any binbags. Also: villages could have helped out with this, we even provided a few with extra binliners. Some did excellent and helped out, others did not. I see a correlation between the loudness of the village and the mess they leave behind. The Geraffel/Chaos West clusters were the center of the waste shit storm. Pizza Village and Milliways second place. Thanks for that. Agree on the glass and trash separation. That was my bad, completely forgot to arrange more glass bins. -- Sebastius (talk)
  • As noted, bins seemed to be very random at being emptied. As suggested earlier, perhaps the larger eurobins?
  • Getting stuff on site using the gold cart and trailers was hit and miss. If you have cars arriving in the car park, the buggies could have waited and taken lots of people stuff at once. Not clearly signed or informed of how that process worked.

Music Lounge

  • Expanses for silent Headphone parties can be spared.
  • Have it a bit further away to keep the noise away from interfering with the talks going on in the two nearby areas

Silent Lounge

  • Having helped at the bar i can say that there was a problem with people asking for a beer (or something else) loudly from outside or ignoring the "no-shoe" sign. -- Bigshot (talk)
  • Sort of worked.

NOC / Network

  • I wish my ISP would have the same quality
  • Connectivity was good most of the time. 2.4Gig mostly worked. Would have been nice if the NOC had let us know about the IPv6 issues at the start rather than just "we've fixed it" as it caused me various problems to start with.

POC / Dect / Fieldphones

  • worked very well
  • I concur. I had no issues using my Dect. Gerne mal wieder! -- Moem (talk)
  • imho easily the most fun people of SHA2017. When DECT spot was closed, some people came by POC tent and help was provided
  • Field phones worked great, I will fondly remember night call from Silent Disco to Pizza Village

Power

  • Was reliable, but not enough outlets. Some areas had nothing attached. Could they not have moved the boxes and just joined the cables together? D Some Ceeform 16A would have made it easier for people who have leads where we use them a lot for camping.
  • If you are going to kill the power at 6PM the night before people have to leave please tell them. We only knew due to having people around from the Orga. Was insulting to have the generator running but no cables left out to power the harbor, not to mention the search light still going.

Alt.pwr

Productiehuis / recordings / track tents / AV / VOC

  • C3VOC did a good job as always.
  • Video walls worked well, although some did get upset at times and have tearing issues. Would be nice if we could get the slides of presentations as well.

Safety / stewards / first aid / Fire Marshalls

  • Where to start on this? You seriously have to look at the Health and Safety. You had people driving heavy plant during the time that visitors were on site during the time that people were allowed on site and also tear down with no banks(wo)men. Driving with loads on their forks and couldn't see in front. Almost all the drivers of the golf buggies were mental (worse than the italians in Rome...) even worse on the main terrain - how anyone was not seriously hurt I don't know. Yes, bomb around, but not where people, especially children are. And no lights.
    • I heard of one foot being run over by a golf cart (without serious consequences, but still). LeonH (talk) 13:10, 15 August 2017 (CEST)
    • In the defense of those driving golf karts and forklifts: Everyone who wanted to use a motorized vehicle from Logistics had to show a valid drivers licence, even those with forklifts. Logistics was very strict in that policy. -- mr_seeker (talk)
  • Site lighting was poor. WE had festoon on the ground from the car park to the main gate. Didn't illuminate it that well and there were large rock lumps on the path. Then no lighting from the main gate taking you in to camp. Main access paths had no lighting, and with the Dutch loving their bikes, zooming past in the dark with no lights - not good considering the amount of booze being consumed. The lighting was then torn out on the Tuesday evening when people were still leaving at night
  • There was an emergency message received by Team Ticket which required fast response. I called Safety on the radio three times within an hour, received an ack, someone was sent to our tent, no one came. I gave up, sorted it out. Luckily we had zero security incidents at the entrance. Thomascovenant

Sysadmin / bofh

  • There were sysadmins? I didn't notice, therefore they did a very good job!
  • Sysadmin for Volunteer System not only kept it running, but spent time by Volunteer Desk giving advice. Well done!

Terrain

  • Should another event occour on this field, the fields on the harbour-side of the dyke should all be powered to allow use. Because they have a ground where water quickly drains, so they never flooded or got overly muddy, and they were well protected from the wind. Many people realized that, and Snowdon field was completely packed with sleeping tents. If Zuse had had power and network infrastructure, it would probably have been well used as well. -- PoempelFox (talk)
    • You should have come to Engelbart, which had only about 10 people camping but network through and power at south end. Having a sprawling camp is good for those who need quieteness for sleep. -- Vadim Makarov (talk)
  • Assigning explicit maximum noise ratings for fields made this event way more enjoyable than the last ones -- Sprawl (talk)
  • the terrain was good but maybe the camp was a bit too "diluted", if the next event will occour in the same terrain it can be a nice idea to close some fields. -- Bigshot (talk)
  • Better water management would make a lot of difference, but I understand that is not easy or cheap. I liked that the camp was so spread out over different fields so one could easily choose more peace and quiet; I'd have hated to be in a noisier area. Please don't pack us into a smaller number of fields! -- Moem (talk)
    • On the case of water management: I noticed during build-up that they were repairing the water pump. Another solution: Walking plates on high-traffic areas, to prevent them from becoming a soggy mess. -- mr_seeker (talk)
  • Camp was over an area a bit too large - could have been condensed down a bit. Quiet areas were a winner for those that wanted it. Its a hack camp, not a techno rave camp. Know issues with the fields being water locked not too much of an issue during the event. Could have been a bigger problem.
  • Car parking worked well. Just a very long walk for some people from the car park back to their village.
  • Site design was not bad. The bar area didnt make much noise at night except for the "music lounge" and I use that term loosely. Could it not have gone the other side of the bar further away from the quiet areas and the talk tents?

Ticket and Entrance

  • See note in the safety area about this
  • Young hackers did a great job as angels

Villages

Worked well. Having some of the reserved areas marked out worked. However, those in campers, unless you turned up on day -2 you couldn't get near to your village area. Needed more areas but perhaps with less vehicles together. Thanks to ccc Village members who took over logistics entrance coordination in addition to their own Village duties. When everything failed and volunteers were scarce or left without instructions etc., you took over and supported them and each other. Doing it together is something that CCC has a good hang of and your experience was very valuable. "Support your people" <3

Volunteering / Angels

  • The food was EXTRA ORDINARY! Kudos to the kitchen crew; please never ever change anything. The food was twice warm meal, it was tasty, it had at several dishes, it was complex to tease one, and I was actually having a full stomach every time and that means something with my bottom less stomach -- Pcdog (talk)
    • I liked the food too. The cooking was done by "Mecklenburger". You can meet them at different festivals and the bigger events done by CCC. They will be at 34c3 in Leipzig for sure.
  • I recommend to put of a sign in the walk way towards the fields and main area to sign up as Angel in the Angel system. This is to have a bigger traction in the beginning of the event.
  • For most of my shifts (even the money handling and/or more complex ones) I never met the person in charge / a coordinator and therefore got different or no instructions.
  • At some point even Heaven was overtaken by volunteers without proper instruction / planning. They did a very good job (thanks for the after midnight coffee delivery!), but at the same moment it felt like the organizers of SHA2017 had lost control over quite big parts of the event.
  • All the angels really were angels. Some of them even working 8+ hours a day beside they had payed >200€ for an ticket!
  • Having only one disinfection machine (and no dishwasher) in the angle kitchen was kind of a bad joke. Delivering over thousands meals every day needs a little up scaling for the cleaning capabilities too ;)
  • Angels make the event. Bribery of food works. Many thanks to them.

Toilets/Showers

  • These were good! Always clean. Too much queueing on the toilets/showers by the harbour (Hopper/Snowden) and Orga, though; this area needs more in future, I was frequently going to other areas of the camp to use facilities. -- Sha2017.org-will-h (talk)
  • Showers variable. The permanent site showers couldn't keep up with the hot water especially in Hopper. The bar needed more toilets in a closer proximity to it. Facilities seemed to be cleaned. Always seems to be a supply of wiping rag.

Miscellaneous

  • Field access after the event was painful especially for those who had a lot of kit to get out. While I understand limiting the vehicles on site - after having several near misses with the golf carts it was ironic limiting the movement of vehicles to that degree. Perhaps send vehicles in a line with a few vehicles going to the same area to get the throughput. Was causing issues in the logistics car park with lorries not being able to turn properly.
  • Some more observations regarding departure & car access after the event from LeonH (talk) 13:07, 15 August 2017 (CEST). The general theme that I see here is the inability to adapt rules and plans set in advance to the circumstances. I was not part of the team, so some of my observations and suggestions may be unfair or unwarranted. Please excuse my ignorance in advance.
    • On the 8th rain was predicted for around 14:00, so many villages were busy tearing down from 12:00 onwards. Yet cars were only allowed starting 17:00. I believe the rules set in advance should have been adapted to the circumstances in this case. I brought this to the attention of Teardown Management & Traffic teams, but I feel my suggestion was rejected without fully considering the discontent this would cause to hundreds of visitors.
    • As a consequence of the restricted car access, luggage shuttles were hopelessly overloaded that afternoon (with people waiting in the rain next to their luggage). I believe there was at least one extra trailer that could have been deployed as a shuttle.
    • The area on the parking were the shuttles dropped luggage was not sheltered and exposed to rain.
    • On the 8th in the afternoon and on the 9th, there was often a long queue of cars at the entrance waiting to get onto the field (our village had to wait ~1h) while the parking situation on the field was very relaxed. I feel the pragmatic thing to do in this case would have been to just maximize the number of cars parking on the field without causing chaos. I think urging villages to pack up before driving their car onto the field was a good idea to maximize throughput.
    • Having bicycle angels accompany cars on the field seemed like a nice idea, but didn't feel very useful in practice. People drive in cities every day without running people over. Inconsiderate people that wanted to drive onto the grass did so anyway, regardless of people telling them over and over not to.