Difference between revisions of "Village:Energy"

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|Village teardown time=2017/08/09
 
|Village teardown time=2017/08/09
 
}}
 
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{{Upgradevillage
 
|Part of=Cluster:AltPwr.Net}}
 
  
The idea is that we create a metropole containing villages / people with tents that all use 42VDC (+/- 8V) as only power source. (On the island maybe?)
+
The idea is that we create a metropole containing villages / people with tents that all use 42VDC (+/- 8V) as only power source.
  
 
WHY?!  
 
WHY?!  
Line 56: Line 54:
  
  
----
+
== The grid will be: ==
 
 
 
 
Alternative power SHA2017: brainfarts benadski
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
[[Image:578a6522953b3193a678f421f50ea8c7.png|left|alt=Example DC power distribution grid]]
 
  
  
 +
*Safe
 +
**ELV (a voltage not exceeding 42.4 Vac peak or 60 Vdc) is safest thing fiddling with, we will limit it to 50V.
 +
**Grid cable strands are individually fused, negative side is earthed.
 +
**Circuit breakers are all DC rated 400V
 +
**The high current side is not accessible for end users
 +
**The incoming 400V part is also shielded
  
  
Example grid left:
 
* red: power central, no user ends. except maybe for a few big power suppliers
 
* yellow: interconnect / user tap point
 
* green: user tap point. tap points are for delivering power too
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
== The grid must be: ==
 
 
*Safe
 
**ELV (a voltage not exceeding 42.4 Vac peak or 60 Vdc) is safest thing fiddling with
 
**Grid cable strands individually fused at least on positive rail, negative: earthed.
 
**Fuses must all be DC rated 60V+ for a DC ELV grid!
 
**High current side not accessible for end users
 
 
 
 
*Accessible
 
*Accessible
**Not too expensive converters for delivering / using power to / from grid.
+
**Not too expensive converters are tested, see the website.
**Connecting should be painless for end users.
+
**Connecting is painless for end users, just connect a cable to one of the 4A circuit breakers and turn it on.
**High power connections for villages must be available
+
**High power connections for villages are available, one or two 16A circuit breakers should be no problem, more needed? Just ask.
  
 
 
 
*24/7 powered
 
*24/7 powered
**Power transformer(s) for power when alt-power is depleted (no sun / wind etc.) ←Benadski already has a 15kW power supply!
+
**Power transformer(s) for power when alt-power is depleted (no sun / wind etc.) ←Benadski already has a 15kW power supply!  
**Small battery backup (not more than 15 minutes?), also doubles as stabilizer.
+
**Maybe some kinds of power storage solutions. If you have an idea, please build&bring!
**Maybe other kinds of backup solutions, like bio-gas / wood-gas generators?
 
  
  
 
*Simple and robust
 
*Simple and robust
**Cables must be able to handle more power than needed
+
**Cables are able to handle more power than needed (unless you are really power hungry, in that case a circuit breaker will alert you. :P)
**A shorted or disconnected cable should not affect the rest of the grid
+
**A shorted or disconnected main cable will not affect the rest of the grid much, it's built of triangles!
  
  
*Smart and anonymous? (not really my expertise, but interesting)
+
*Smart?  
**Should a user need more power temporarily, let her/him access the power grid somehow to get some more? Can this be made non-traceable / anonymous?
+
**Voltage dependent power, users can control when they use power just looking at the grid voltage. A converter can auto-start when there is plenty of power for instance.
**Let the network warn people when power demands are too high / voltage is low?
+
***42V is the magic number, above this number means there is clean power available, below 42V means running on diesel.
**Voltage dependant power, users can control when they use power just looking at the grid voltage. A converter can auto-start when there is plenty of power for instance.
+
**Some statistics will be recorded, but not down to village/user level. If you like to log/upload your statistics, use the mqtt server!
 
+
**Maybe somebody can build a nice dashboard thingie.
  
  
Line 126: Line 93:
  
 
*42VDC? (range 34-50V, some safety to make sure >60V will never be reached) (42V is 7 6V batteries in series)
 
*42VDC? (range 34-50V, some safety to make sure >60V will never be reached) (42V is 7 6V batteries in series)
*2A per user (enough for charging laptops, having blinkenlights etc.), average use under 0,667A
+
*4A per user (enough for charging laptops, having blinkenlights etc.), average use under 0,667A
*16A per village (to power a fridge, 4 laptops and lots of lights and/or audio), avg 6A
+
*16A to 32A per village (to power a fridge, 4 laptops and lots of lights and/or audio), avg 6A
 
*Power generation, 32A max. 4 connections totaling 64A max. per power node. ZB: 32+19+1+12
 
*Power generation, 32A max. 4 connections totaling 64A max. per power node. ZB: 32+19+1+12
 
*300 users * 0,667A + 10 villages * 6A = 260A. 260A * 42V => 11kW average usage, estimated peak 15kW.
 
*300 users * 0,667A + 10 villages * 6A = 260A. 260A * 42V => 11kW average usage, estimated peak 15kW.
*Cables should handle about 25% of max. current => 52A, fused at 50A slo-blo
+
*5x6mm2 cables are used between nodes Each wire is protected by a 32A class C circuit breaker.
*4x6mm2 can probably handle the current, but there cannot be a yellow/green conductor carrying current.
+
*PTC fuses are excellent for user end protection, cheap and will auto reset.
*5x10mm2 is better, earth wire is now used for earth only. Voltage drops are lower, less losses. 5x16mm2 is awesome but very expensive...
+
*Battery backup / stabilizer idea: 7x6V 10Ah at every node of the grid. Decouples below 35V, starts charging again above 42V. Maybe bigger one at the center of the grid, 12Ah or higher
*PTC fuses are excellent for user end protection, but must be pre-fused. One 16A per 8 2A outputs should do the trick
+
*We have a 220W load for destroying excess power when >48V is reached at each node. And a powerful circuit breaker tripping device to disconnect a node if >50V might occur.
*Battery backup / stabilizer: 7x6V 10Ah at every corner of the grid. Decouples below 35V, starts charging again above 42V. Maybe bigger one at the center of the grid, 12Ah or higher
 
*We need a big load for destroying excess power when >48V (or store it somehow, see below)
 
*The whole concept / ruleset must be open and accessible online at least one half year before the event.
 
 
 
  
  
Line 145: Line 108:
  
 
*Water tower for storing energy and big-ass stat display. (Energy capacity fairly low)
 
*Water tower for storing energy and big-ass stat display. (Energy capacity fairly low)
*Big crane structure lifting / lowering a concrete weight or an old car to store / deliver power.
+
*Big crane structure lifting / lowering a concrete weight or an old car to store / deliver power (didn't calculate the capacity).
*Woodgas generator
+
*A woodgas generator delivers semi clean power to the grid.
*Biogas generator (from local biological waste like dead food, NOT from feces and/or pee) ←This could create horrible stench, use with care!  
+
*Biogas generator (from local biological waste like dead food, NOT from feces and/or pee) ←This could create horrible stench, please don't!  
 
*Electrical bacteria farm (http://www.nwo.nl/en/research-and-results/cases/bio-batteries-in-the-seabed.html)
 
*Electrical bacteria farm (http://www.nwo.nl/en/research-and-results/cases/bio-batteries-in-the-seabed.html)
 
*Bicycle gym with generators (near showers please!)
 
*Bicycle gym with generators (near showers please!)
 
*Design nice converters people can buy for little money (open hardware):
 
*Design nice converters people can buy for little money (open hardware):
**>36V => 19V / 12V / 5V for powering stuff, with grid status outputs ←Benadski already has some (30+!) >38V to 12V20A converters for the power lurkers. These will be installed inside the yellow/green tap points.
+
**>36V => 19V / 12V / 5V for powering stuff, with grid status outputs
**5..42V => 36..48V (auto optimum point detection) for delivering power to the grid.
+
*Data over power, for general grid stats or other cool things.←Will be implemented!
**48..120V => 36..48V same as above. for the awesome solar frontier panels for instance.
 
*Data over power, for general grid stats or other cool things.
 
 
*Use the motion of people to generate power somehow. (children's playground power / walkways)
 
*Use the motion of people to generate power somehow. (children's playground power / walkways)
 
*Store excess energy in water heating for dish washing / showering, pre-heated water needs further heating before it's used.
 
*Store excess energy in water heating for dish washing / showering, pre-heated water needs further heating before it's used.
*Limited number of alt-power tickets for participants will make sure people can participate. No disappointments. But I don't like limitations... What to do?
 
  
=== `High' voltage DC interlinks (a.k.a. decentralized nanogrid) ===
+
 
For anything past ~ 20 meters, low voltage DC becomes effictively unfeasable. Meaning, you could wire up maybe to tents but not really set up any larger energy sharing structure.
+
=== 'High' voltage DC interlinks (a.k.a. decentralized nanogrid) ===
 +
For anything past ~ 20 meters, low voltage DC becomes effictively unfeasable using thin cables. Meaning, you could wire up maybe to tents but not really set up any larger energy sharing structure.
 
However, there are bidirectional converters between 48 VDC and 380 VDC that would allow creating a proper grid with minimal required architectural input. As AC cables are safe for these DC voltages as well, this would allow for essentially a plug and play type of grid.
 
However, there are bidirectional converters between 48 VDC and 380 VDC that would allow creating a proper grid with minimal required architectural input. As AC cables are safe for these DC voltages as well, this would allow for essentially a plug and play type of grid.
  
So what needs to happen to get this implemented?
+
So what needs to happen to get this implemented in the future?
* Buy/beg/borrow some of [https://uk.tdk-lambda.com/news/article.aspx?cid=7495 these devies]
+
* Buy/beg/borrow some of [https://uk.tdk-lambda.com/news/article.aspx?cid=7495 these devices]
* FInd a simple DIY way of wiring up proper fuses/spark detectors
+
* Find a simple DIY way of wiring up proper fuses/spark detectors
  
In this case it woul be cool enough just to have two 48 V systems connected over a single 380 VDC line, as the worlds first prototype of a truly decentralized DC grid.
+
In this case it would be cool enough just to have two 48 V systems connected over a single 380VDC line, as the worlds first prototype of a truly decentralized DC grid.
  
 
Sounds interesting? Want to work on this? More feedback? Contact [[User:DokterBob|DokterBob]] and/or look at [https://dcgrid.hackpad.com/ this hackpad] with prior research and at [https://dokterbob.gitbooks.io/stealmyideas/content/decentralized_high-voltage_dc_grids.html this article]
 
Sounds interesting? Want to work on this? More feedback? Contact [[User:DokterBob|DokterBob]] and/or look at [https://dcgrid.hackpad.com/ this hackpad] with prior research and at [https://dokterbob.gitbooks.io/stealmyideas/content/decentralized_high-voltage_dc_grids.html this article]

Revision as of 20:41, 30 April 2017


Village Name Energy

Village-Energy.png

Generated SHA Flag (experiment here)
Website https://www.altpwr.net
Contact benadski@altpwr.net
Part of Cluster Cluster:AltPwr.Net

Add.png create cluster

Assigned Field
Description 42V central station, here you can get some kits to protect your equipment in case a DCDC gets fried.
Members

Edit your membership on your user page, here, and then on "edit with form" at the top.

Projects

Add.png create project

Self-organized Sessions

Add.png create self-organized session

Interests dc
dc
, microgrid
microgrid
, alternative power sources
alternative power sources
, 42v
42v
, solar
solar
, wind
wind
Registered on 13 February 2016 21:05:51
Hosts self-organized sessions No
Other villages by tags...
refresh


Name Arrival Departure Bringing
flokli Verfied.png Thu Aug 3 18:00 Tue Aug 8 0:00 Bag full of cables and electronic foo, Gin, Racebike, Laptop
1 inhabitants. Refresh this list. You can add yourself to a village by editing your profile page, here.
Orga contact benadski@altpwr.net
Citizens
Needs network Villages describe network needs
Needs power
Power comment
Village plans ... bring some special machines, ... have any other unusual installations, ... bring/build big stuff
Village constraints
Village comments plans
Provides transport for
Has plans with tracks
Size needed
Has order interest
Planning notes


The idea is that we create a metropole containing villages / people with tents that all use 42VDC (+/- 8V) as only power source.

WHY?!

  • Because power hacking is COOL!
  • DC grids are HOT!
  • <50(60)VDC is relatively safe.
  • You can connect your:
    • Wind generators
    • Solar cells
    • Woodgas generator
    • Electrical bacteria soup
    • Hamster wheels
    • Fitness gym equipment
    • Pocket fusion generator
    • INSERT YOUR POWER IDEA HERE



HOW MUCH POWER? 1.21 JIGOWATTS!

Benadski has a plan and some stuff prepared already. Contact him for the details in the RevSpace IRC channel, or read on.


The grid will be:

  • Safe
    • ELV (a voltage not exceeding 42.4 Vac peak or 60 Vdc) is safest thing fiddling with, we will limit it to 50V.
    • Grid cable strands are individually fused, negative side is earthed.
    • Circuit breakers are all DC rated 400V
    • The high current side is not accessible for end users
    • The incoming 400V part is also shielded


  • Accessible
    • Not too expensive converters are tested, see the website.
    • Connecting is painless for end users, just connect a cable to one of the 4A circuit breakers and turn it on.
    • High power connections for villages are available, one or two 16A circuit breakers should be no problem, more needed? Just ask.


  • 24/7 powered
    • Power transformer(s) for power when alt-power is depleted (no sun / wind etc.) ←Benadski already has a 15kW power supply!
    • Maybe some kinds of power storage solutions. If you have an idea, please build&bring!


  • Simple and robust
    • Cables are able to handle more power than needed (unless you are really power hungry, in that case a circuit breaker will alert you. :P)
    • A shorted or disconnected main cable will not affect the rest of the grid much, it's built of triangles!


  • Smart?
    • Voltage dependent power, users can control when they use power just looking at the grid voltage. A converter can auto-start when there is plenty of power for instance.
      • 42V is the magic number, above this number means there is clean power available, below 42V means running on diesel.
    • Some statistics will be recorded, but not down to village/user level. If you like to log/upload your statistics, use the mqtt server!
    • Maybe somebody can build a nice dashboard thingie.


Numb3rs and sort of facts:

(all are sucked out of my thumb): ←I know, I know that's not an English expression (yet!) But used in many other countries, so: adapt! :P


  • 42VDC? (range 34-50V, some safety to make sure >60V will never be reached) (42V is 7 6V batteries in series)
  • 4A per user (enough for charging laptops, having blinkenlights etc.), average use under 0,667A
  • 16A to 32A per village (to power a fridge, 4 laptops and lots of lights and/or audio), avg 6A
  • Power generation, 32A max. 4 connections totaling 64A max. per power node. ZB: 32+19+1+12
  • 300 users * 0,667A + 10 villages * 6A = 260A. 260A * 42V => 11kW average usage, estimated peak 15kW.
  • 5x6mm2 cables are used between nodes Each wire is protected by a 32A class C circuit breaker.
  • PTC fuses are excellent for user end protection, cheap and will auto reset.
  • Battery backup / stabilizer idea: 7x6V 10Ah at every node of the grid. Decouples below 35V, starts charging again above 42V. Maybe bigger one at the center of the grid, 12Ah or higher
  • We have a 220W load for destroying excess power when >48V is reached at each node. And a powerful circuit breaker tripping device to disconnect a node if >50V might occur.


Wild ideas next!

  • Water tower for storing energy and big-ass stat display. (Energy capacity fairly low)
  • Big crane structure lifting / lowering a concrete weight or an old car to store / deliver power (didn't calculate the capacity).
  • A woodgas generator delivers semi clean power to the grid.
  • Biogas generator (from local biological waste like dead food, NOT from feces and/or pee) ←This could create horrible stench, please don't!
  • Electrical bacteria farm (http://www.nwo.nl/en/research-and-results/cases/bio-batteries-in-the-seabed.html)
  • Bicycle gym with generators (near showers please!)
  • Design nice converters people can buy for little money (open hardware):
    • >36V => 19V / 12V / 5V for powering stuff, with grid status outputs
  • Data over power, for general grid stats or other cool things.←Will be implemented!
  • Use the motion of people to generate power somehow. (children's playground power / walkways)
  • Store excess energy in water heating for dish washing / showering, pre-heated water needs further heating before it's used.


'High' voltage DC interlinks (a.k.a. decentralized nanogrid)

For anything past ~ 20 meters, low voltage DC becomes effictively unfeasable using thin cables. Meaning, you could wire up maybe to tents but not really set up any larger energy sharing structure. However, there are bidirectional converters between 48 VDC and 380 VDC that would allow creating a proper grid with minimal required architectural input. As AC cables are safe for these DC voltages as well, this would allow for essentially a plug and play type of grid.

So what needs to happen to get this implemented in the future?

  • Buy/beg/borrow some of these devices
  • Find a simple DIY way of wiring up proper fuses/spark detectors

In this case it would be cool enough just to have two 48 V systems connected over a single 380VDC line, as the worlds first prototype of a truly decentralized DC grid.

Sounds interesting? Want to work on this? More feedback? Contact DokterBob and/or look at this hackpad with prior research and at this article